Comments on: Decline of the Empire — Now What? http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/ Truth in Energy Thu, 09 Feb 2012 01:14:04 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: 2009 — A Year We Will Live To Regret :: ASPO-USA: Association for the Study of Peak Oil and Gas http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3699 2009 — A Year We Will Live To Regret :: ASPO-USA: Association for the Study of Peak Oil and Gas Thu, 17 Dec 2009 19:11:37 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3699 [...] Ineffectiveness, bad faith and corruption are endemic in America’s public institutions. Our hijacked government can no longer be an agent of meaningful change. The Vicious Circle of Futility I described in Decline of the American Empire now appears to be a permanent feature of the American landscape. (Figure 5 with the original caption). Also look at Decline of the Empire—Now What? [...] [...] Ineffectiveness, bad faith and corruption are endemic in America’s public institutions. Our hijacked government can no longer be an agent of meaningful change. The Vicious Circle of Futility I described in Decline of the American Empire now appears to be a permanent feature of the American landscape. (Figure 5 with the original caption). Also look at Decline of the Empire—Now What? [...]

]]> By: Bill Simpson in Slidell http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3482 Bill Simpson in Slidell Wed, 11 Nov 2009 09:14:43 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3482 You must remember that the US is still the World's only country with a global reach military and the largest economy. If we go down, for any reason, it could take the rest of the industrial world down with us. The rest of the world knows it. That is why Washington can keep printing however much money it takes to prevent a depression and deflationary collapse. They will worry about the inflationary problems later. Things are going to get rough, but it won't be the end of civilization, because too many fossil fuels still remain on this planet. When they are gone, then most people will starve until the population stabilizes at a much lower level. That will be far in the future. If fusion can be perfected, we are home free because it is limitless. Solar also holds great potential. You must remember that the US is still the World’s only country with a global reach military and the largest economy. If we go down, for any reason, it could take the rest of the industrial world down with us. The rest of the world knows it. That is why Washington can keep printing however much money it takes to prevent a depression and deflationary collapse. They will worry about the inflationary problems later.
Things are going to get rough, but it won’t be the end of civilization, because too many fossil fuels still remain on this planet. When they are gone, then most people will starve until the population stabilizes at a much lower level. That will be far in the future. If fusion can be perfected, we are home free because it is limitless. Solar also holds great potential.

]]> By: Don Hirschberg http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3454 Don Hirschberg Sat, 07 Nov 2009 07:14:32 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3454 As a Peak Oiler since the early ‘70s I have considered that our situation would be part of the demise of the civilization not merely problems for the US. Except for a straw of hope I had for fusion energy I saw excessive population and depletion of oil as unsolvable problems. It has only gotten worse and I cannot see any combinations of the best actions that can save us. In fact new depletions, notably water, and the awesome population increases have made my dismal prediction far easier and more confident. Born in 1927 I find it quite curious that I will have witnessed the consumption of most of the world’s endowment of conventional oil and an unbelievable increase in population. As I was born world population ticked over to 3 billion. It is now about to tick over to 7 billion. There are billions of people today who live in abject poverty. Only recently, using fossil fuels, did the world manage to keep as many as one 1 billion people alive at the same time. Progress? Oddly, it is not the ghastly prospect of the death of billions though starvation and war and disease that I lose sleep over – it is how lousy I find mankind. Lousy behavior, venality and ignorance without even the self-respect and discipline to avoid gross obesity. Far, far worse than even 60 years ago. I have had a very interesting life, know a lot about the world, and have a lot to tell. I had always thought there would be some wonderful days when grandchildren and others would want to listen as I listened at every opportunity as a youngster. Never once happened. I can think of many reasons but I reluctantly come to the conclusion they are too dumb to understand what I say. They all got A’s. I got mostly C’s. They were in classes of about 20; my classes were usually over 40 and often with two grades in the same room. I learned far more. As a Peak Oiler since the early ‘70s I have considered that our situation would be part of the demise of the civilization not merely problems for the US. Except for a straw of hope I had for fusion energy I saw excessive population and depletion of oil as unsolvable problems. It has only gotten worse and I cannot see any combinations of the best actions that can save us. In fact new depletions, notably water, and the awesome population increases have made my dismal prediction far easier and more confident.

Born in 1927 I find it quite curious that I will have witnessed the consumption of most of the world’s endowment of conventional oil and an unbelievable increase in population. As I was born world population ticked over to 3 billion. It is now about to tick over to 7 billion. There are billions of people today who live in abject poverty. Only recently, using fossil fuels, did the world manage to keep as many as one 1 billion people alive at the same time. Progress?

Oddly, it is not the ghastly prospect of the death of billions though starvation and war and disease that I lose sleep over – it is how lousy I find mankind. Lousy behavior, venality and ignorance without even the self-respect and discipline to avoid gross obesity. Far, far worse than even 60 years ago. I have had a very interesting life, know a lot about the world, and have a lot to tell. I had always thought there would be some wonderful days when grandchildren and others would want to listen as I listened at every opportunity as a youngster. Never once happened. I can think of many reasons but I reluctantly come to the conclusion they are too dumb to understand what I say. They all got A’s. I got mostly C’s. They were in classes of about 20; my classes were usually over 40 and often with two grades in the same room. I learned far more.

]]> By: Russ http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3449 Russ Fri, 06 Nov 2009 23:28:31 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3449 <i>Many people don’t realize that it’s hope that’s killing them. Almost invariably, our greatest hopes are dashed. When we realize that our hopes are unattainable, disillusionment and bitterness often follow. And then, maybe, wisdom.</i> Children are often taught that Hope remained behind in Pandora's Box in order to help man cope with the evils Pandora had unleashed. But in fact the Greeks were rather ambivalent about that. To them the moral was uncertain, for perhaps hope is not a blessing, not where it's a substitute for confronting truth, however unpleasant. Many people don’t realize that it’s hope that’s killing them. Almost invariably, our greatest hopes are dashed. When we realize that our hopes are unattainable, disillusionment and bitterness often follow. And then, maybe, wisdom.

Children are often taught that Hope remained behind in Pandora’s Box in order to help man cope with the evils Pandora had unleashed. But in fact the Greeks were rather ambivalent about that. To them the moral was uncertain, for perhaps hope is not a blessing, not where it’s a substitute for confronting truth, however unpleasant.

]]> By: Scott Benson http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3448 Scott Benson Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:35:13 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3448 On a happier note, thanks for the picture of you. :) It makes you feel like maybe the non-mainstream media is at least listening to the common man (common as I am). But I would have to say that .. for all the hope and wishing and praying for America as a concept to shrivel and die, I think my overfed, overhoused, oversecure fellow Americans, many of who have never had a really BAD day in their lives, have no idea what the loss of empire, financial power and most of all, oil, can do to a country and economy dependent on all of those. No TV? No electricity? No strawberries for $1.99 a quart? We shouldn't wish too much for a worldwide cataclysm, just so we can shake our fists in the air and yell "See???? Told ya!!! I was right!!!!" Growing your own food and protecting your family can get very overwhelming very fast. In the end, if the American empire is indeed over, like so many before it, we will adapt as needed. And if we had to move on, like the poor Irish in the 1800s, we will find a way to do that ... most likely moving to a communist empire growing and snorting across the ocean ... :( On a happier note, thanks for the picture of you. :) It makes you feel like maybe the non-mainstream media is at least listening to the common man (common as I am).

But I would have to say that .. for all the hope and wishing and praying for America as a concept to shrivel and die, I think my overfed, overhoused, oversecure fellow Americans, many of who have never had a really BAD day in their lives, have no idea what the loss of empire, financial power and most of all, oil, can do to a country and economy dependent on all of those. No TV? No electricity? No strawberries for $1.99 a quart? We shouldn’t wish too much for a worldwide cataclysm, just so we can shake our fists in the air and yell “See???? Told ya!!! I was right!!!!” Growing your own food and protecting your family can get very overwhelming very fast.

In the end, if the American empire is indeed over, like so many before it, we will adapt as needed. And if we had to move on, like the poor Irish in the 1800s, we will find a way to do that … most likely moving to a communist empire growing and snorting across the ocean … :(

]]> By: John Andersen http://www.aspousa.org/index.php/2009/11/decline-of-the-empire-now-what/#comment-3445 John Andersen Fri, 06 Nov 2009 14:55:55 +0000 http://www.aspousa.org/?p=2766#comment-3445 Dave, I appreciated this frank assessment of the insanity that has taken over the way the USA responds to economic problems. As a political entity, the USA is in its final phase. The future will inevitably involve disintegration. The truly hopeful outcome after disintegration will be local, intact, sane communities of people who, in through observing the failed experiment of the USA, will wisely (and permanently) turn their hearts and minds toward the furthering the public good. Dave,

I appreciated this frank assessment of the insanity that has taken over the way the USA responds to economic problems.

As a political entity, the USA is in its final phase. The future will inevitably involve disintegration.

The truly hopeful outcome after disintegration will be local, intact, sane communities of people who, in through observing the failed experiment of the USA, will wisely (and permanently) turn their hearts and minds toward the furthering the public good.

]]>